Ok, pissed off now

[oyceter]

Yup, this is public; I am that pissed off.

I wasn't going to get involved, I swear I wasn't.

And then...

http://liviapenn.livejournal.com/473180.html?thread=6512732#t6512732

Because what the fucking fuck? Don't fucking throw the RAPE OF NANKING in my face when I am talking about white privilege. I just. I cannot type because WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK?! My grandfather was in the Chinese Navy then, fighting against the Japanese. I have friends with relatives who grew up not speaking Taiwanese because of the occupation. My family left the fucking country and moved to Taiwan because of that war. Don't throw that in my face as a counter to white privilege and just fucking assume I haven't heard of it for some reason; you have no fucking idea.

Comments by people not on my flist are screened; everyone else feel free to comment, but please note I am REALLY FUCKING PISSED OFF about this. Don't be stupid. I will repost asshattery under a filter and mock, and I don't fucking care if you somehow think that's unfair.

Comments

[veejane.livejournal.com]

Ummmm, yeah. Just, yeah. The logical fallacy is formally called tu quoque, which is Latin for "I know you are but what am I?", and is defined as a situation where the arguer attempts to distract from the weaknesses in his argument by noticing non-germane faults in his interlocutor.

Also known as: FAIL AT RHETORIC.

I've had cause to note that fallacy twice today, and am beginning to wonder if it holds a special place in the hearts of racism-deniers. (Actually, probably deniers of anything, but racism deniers use it with such obnoxious panache.) There's something about saying, "other people do it too" that provides such a balm for the conscience that can't bear to be troubled.

Which is also FAIL AT LIFE, as you have noted.

am beginning to wonder if it holds a special place in the hearts of racism-deniers.

[jonquil.livejournal.com]

Of course it does.

Because if any living person of color, anywhere, in any country, has ever done something racist, then NOTHING ANY WHITE PERSON EVER DOES COUNTS.

Al Sharpton gave us whiteys a free pass forever. So, apparently, did Emperor Hirohito.

Re: am beginning to wonder if it holds a special place in the hearts of racism-deniers.

[oyceter]

*snorfles* What you said!

Re: am beginning to wonder if it holds a special place in the hearts of racism-deniers.

[oursin.livejournal.com]

I was about to say, 'Oh good, does the British Empire get a free pass, because, hey, Black Hole of Calcutta?' I could probably think of a few other examples, but, Duh, I don't think so, really.

There's a whole wide chasm between occasional atrocities perpetrated by members of one culture upon another, and the apparatus of institutionalised oppression and discrimination.

Re: am beginning to wonder if it holds a special place in the hearts of racism-deniers.

[oyceter]

There's a whole wide chasm between occasional atrocities perpetrated by members of one culture upon another, and the apparatus of institutionalised oppression and discrimination.

I am so boggled that people have been refusing to get this one point! Because.. yeah. What you said.

[oyceter]

SO FAIL AT LIFE!

Not only is he trying to distract from the weakness in his argument, he is wrong! And the next thing I am posting is going to be the Japan Law of Racism with the China Corollary in which anyone who mentions racism in China without referring to the East India Company, Hong Kong, the two Opium Wars, the opium trade, the silver imbalance, imperialism, the treaties of Nanking and Tientsin, the splitting open of China for Western trade, the divvying up of China into "spheres of influence" (guess whose influence?!) among several Western countries, and the Boxer Rebellion FAILS TEN TIMES OVER. Because fuck that! You don't get to use my history like that! (sorry. Not you you. Him-you.)

Sigh. I thought I had calmed down but clearly not. Yes, that hit quite a few of my buttons why do you ask? ;)

[delux-vivens.livejournal.com]

opium wars, hong kong, boxer rebellion, east india?

why are you dwelling on these minor historical details?

[oyceter]

Oh yes, I forgot! Facts about racism are actually defamation and slander that oppress people who want to use racist terms, silly me.

[matociquala.livejournal.com]

I think I love you.

And of course "other people do it too..." I think something that happens is that a lot of liberal/would-be enlightened white people have a shitload of guilt, and want to not be the only assholes in the world who are being blamed (feel they are being blamed) for having done something rotten.

(God knows I feel like I would be less automatically suspect if the Cherokee and Ukrainian percentage in my ancestry were reversed.)

But of course the thing is that it's not about blame. It's not about the balancing act, makin' sure everybody gets thier fair dollop of responsibility. It's about not making racist/privileged assumptions.

People who have had white/male/middle-class/heterosexual privilege all their lives don't recognize it for what it is, how powerful and pervasive it is, and are simultaneously afraid of losing it. And of course the goal (or what I see as the goal) is not to strip people of rights; it's to make sure that everybody has access to the same rights.