Dunnett, Dorothy - The Disorderly Knights

[oyceter]

Many thanks to those who told me to have Pawn right in hand after I finished this, or else I would probably be writhing in agony at this moment.

Dunnett is wreaking havoc on my already horrible sleeping patterns. Could not put down Disorderly Knights, despite the whole having to get up for work the next day thing.

Warning: there is pretty much nothing intelligent under the cut, just lots of wibbling.

She killed off Tom Erskin and Will Scott and Buccleuch!!! Ok, so they're historical characters and probably died right that way, but still! Wah. And when did Gideon Somerville die?

I adore the Somerville women so very, very, very much. Absolutely adore. And wibbled mightily at the moment when Philippa basically rescues Lymond and he tells her that she shouldn't keep this image of him in her head either. And the Somervilles are just so wonderfully practical and snarky and down to earth. Despite all the great swashbuckling adventure and the maneuvering, the parts I like best are Lymond and his family and the Somervilles just sort of being normal and family-like (well, as normal as the Culters get).

I started out not being sure if I wanted to smack Joleta or not. Decided I definitely wanted to smack her when she went about doing her "I am in love with Lymond" thing. Jaw nearly dropped when I discovered she was not just selfish yet beautiful. Though I was not so fond of the prevailing evilness of promiscuity (or promiscuity indicating evilness in women) thing. My favorite Joleta moment is when Sybilla is telling Richard and Lymond her observations on Joleta's personality, and through the giant list of Joleta's scary moments, all Richard can think of to say is: "Killed your cat?" Hee. I like Richard. Another wonderful Richard moment was him backing Lymond in the decision to go right after Gabriel. *wibble* Sibling bonds are apparently my great weakness (I adore the Buffy-Dawn relationship as well). And Sybilla is, as always, her own wonderful self. I love how she's the only one who opinion Lymond really is afraid of and how he begs Richard not to tell Sybilla about Joleta.

Gabriel is really scary. First he was scary because he was too nice and holy. Now he's just evil mastermind scary.

And again, can I mention just how much I love the Somervilles and Philippa in particular? I was scared a bit in the beginning that Joleta was going to be the Love Interest because of all the rapturous description of her beautiful apricot hair (etc. etc.), and I love how the Somervilles are mouse-colored and plain and flat-chested and dingy but wonderful nonetheless.

How old is Lymond anyway? Dunnett very narrowly avoided having me dislike him immensely (the entire sleeping with sixteen-year-old Joleta thing and the knocking Philippa out thing) by showing us why he did those things in the end, but I still dislike Lymond the Womanizer. I keep forgetting how young some of the people are -- I'm constantly startled when Dunnett refers to the nineteen-year-old Margaret Erskine, because she sounds so much older. I suppose a big part of that is average life span, etc. back then.

I keep feeling bad that everyone is trying to protect Queen Mary, because I know she's going to end up executed on order of Elizabeth, and I wonder if Dunnett's going to get the narrative that far.

Oonagh O'Dwyer is now on the cool female character list, although she does not inspire the same love that Margaret Erskine, Sybilla, Kate and Philippa do.

Have I by any chance mentioned how much I love Philippa and Kate?

Links:
- rilina's review
- oracne's review

Comments

heeee

[cofax7]

there is pretty much nothing intelligent under the cut, just lots of wibbling.

Seems pretty intelligent to me...

I adore the scene where Richard backs up Francis, because Richard's not stupid enough to let his anger get in the way. And I cry for Will Scott and Buccleuch every damned time, even though, yes, that's how they died. Weeping for men nearly five hundred years dead. Sigh.

I love the Somervilles. There's a society on Dunnetwork (the grand dame of Dunnett lists) called The Kate Somerville Food-Wearing Society, whose members all admit to spilling things on themselves while cooking. *g* Kate and Philippa are so marvelously pragmatic, and it's such a solid counterpoint to the angsty romantic Crawfords. Kate I could live with: Francis would drive me to drink within hours, no doubt.

Gideon died between QP and DK, but we never really hear how. Which is too bad, because he was also marvelous.

Lymond's age is a secret to most of the other characters (remember when Richard asks him if he'd ever told Will how old he was?), but IIRC he's about 21 in Game of Kings. I forget how old that makes him by DK: 25? Something like that.

So fun to watch someone else geeking over these. In a way, Dunnett was my first fandom, and the one I keep returning to.

(This icon has the phrase Will uses to describe Janet Beaton, in the beginning of DK.)

Re: heeee

[oyceter]

Oooh, yeah, Richard. And I love his reasoning -- he knows Lymond and he knows just how bad things must be for Lymond to actually be asking for help.

I adore the Somervilles because they can actually sometimes manage Lymond just because they're so down to earth, as opposed to Lymond's grand theatrics and lone hero schtick. It's funny -- in Game of Kings I would have expected Lymond's female counterpart to be someone like Oonagh O'Dwyer, very grand, very melodramatic, but this works so much better. I can just see Kate and Philippa rolling their eyes at Lymond.

Gah, Lymond's so young! Eep. I must keep reminding myself people in general had more responsibilities at younger ages.

I'm totally geeking out over these now ^_^. After GK and QP, I was pretty good and hooked, but I just went through an entire day of pretty boring work with a huge grin on my face because I'd finished Disorderly Knights and was happily mentally reviewing favorite scenes. There's a whole Dunnett fandom?? Ooooooooo.....

[oracne.livejournal.com]

I love the Somervilles, too. And, and, I would say more, but I'm just wibbling. Ummm....

When I first read this one, I wasn't spoiled at all, so I kept wondering why everyone said Gabriel was so Faboo when I thought he was kind of annoying and holier-than-thou. Then I Found Out. Eek! And I stayed up really late reading. And wibbling.

I found some of my (very brief) posts on reading Dunnett:
GAME OF KINGS:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/oracne/2003/01/14/
DISORDERLY KNIGHTS:
http://www.livejournal.com/users/oracne/209906.html

[oyceter]

Ooo, thanks for the links!! Always appreciated.

I was a little bit spoiled (I'd read the flaps of the other books because I was horribly impatient), but as the book went on, I sort of figured Lymond would do something horrible to Joleta, which would send the saintly Gabriel over the edge. I was a bit irked at that idea, because I didn't much like Gabriel or Joleta.

I just adore how Dunnett keeps avoiding all these easy fanfiction-esque traps: she never lets Lymond grow too sympathetic, and she just somehow avoids Mary Sues and people too good to be true.

[queenofthorns.livejournal.com]

I assume Gideon died of one of the many diseases so prevalent during the period - and I like that not everyone in the book dies in some heroic and arms bearing way, because that's a tad more realistic.

I have to confess my big old crush on Jerrott Blythe - I know he's a total doof sometimes, but I lurve him anyway. And I fell madly in love with Philippa Somerville in this book. As for Joleta, in the end, I just felt sorry for her. Whereas Gabriel is incredibly creepy, evil, and eeeeee!

Lymond is very young indeed (which um, makes me doubt a little bit some of the stuff he did prior to Game of Kings, but I let it slide in the interests of what a great character he is!)

all the most beautiful men become priests

[cofax7]

I love Jerott too, fucked up as he is. Every book has to have one character who fundamentally misunderstands Lymond while loving him at the same time, and Jerott carries that burden for several books, poor fella.

Re: all the most beautiful men become priests

[oyceter]

Halfway through Pawn, and really want to just hug Jerott ^_^.

He actually reminds me a bit of Richard.

[oyceter]

I totally forgot to mention Jerrott! Bad me. I really like Jerrott and his struggles with his conscience.

I really like how Dunnett is not afraid to kill off characters. Hrm. Though I wonder if it counts as her doing the killing off of historical characters. But she killed Christian Stewart in the first book, then Turkey Mat. I like an author who's willing to do that without being nihilistic.

I have the giantest girlcrush on Philippa. She is cool. (and she had weasels!)

[rilina.livejournal.com]

IIRC, when I was first reading Dunnett, I didn't have PIF on hand and resorted to reading 50 pages online via Amazon.com's "Search inside the book" feature. Yay obsession.

Lymond is so good at making himself hated by others. But there's always that moment when the facade breaks (like his words to Philippa after she rescues him), and the reader's only left to wibble.

Not sure if you're interested, but here are my Dunnett (http://www.livejournal.com/tools/memories.bml?user=rilina&keyword=Dorothy+Dunnett&filter=all) posts.

[oyceter]

Thanks for the link!! They're always appreciated (and I feel good, not wibbling into the void, as it were).

I think I've reread that scene between Lymond and Philippa in Knights several times already, hee hee.

*wibbles*

[minnow1212.livejournal.com]

>She killed off Tom Erskin and Will Scott and Buccleuch!!!<

I know! It's so awful. I was so excited to see Will in the books again after he wasn't in book 2, and then...curses!

>Another wonderful Richard moment was him backing Lymond in the decision to go right after Gabriel.<

Isn't that *fabulous*????

Kate and Philippa, Philippa and Kate, oh yes.

I think you've nailed a lot of my favorite parts in the book. Yay!

[oyceter]

I wanted to hug Richard then, or cheer, or something (except it was sometime around 3 in the morning and the neighbors might have noticed).

Gah, these books are making me so happy.

^_^

[sartorias.livejournal.com]

Elizabeth and Mary Stuart were much, much older (middle aged) when Elizabeth reluctantly signed the death warrant, don't worry. The books stop far before then.

(And Dunnett, being a loyal Scotswoman, makes Mary come off a whole lot better than she did in RL.)

Pardon my buttinsky; I remember with great fondness reading these books in a 48 hour orgy just after Checkmate finally came out, and I love seeing others experience them.

Warning, you had better have Ringed Castle on hand after you finished Pawn in Frankincense...and do not attempt the end of the latter late at night.

[oyceter]

It's really interesting reading these books, because my main image of Mary de Guise was in the movie Elizabeth, and I never quite had a real impression of Mary Stuart in the first place.

No, no, no buttinsky, I am having giant amounts of fun squeeing with everyone ^_^. Plus, my boyfriend is starting to look at me funny because I keep trying to read lines out to him (and gasping in shock, and giggling).

I luckily raided the library and have everything here, ready, so I don't die waiting.