So I've written this comment in my head several times, ever since I saw your utter bogglement at the people in your Cultural Appropriation Post of Doom who said they considered Asian people white. Each time I decided not to post because, honestly, I'm a wee bit socially anxious and don't want to accidentally offend people. Better to just be quiet right? Only not, because that's the whole point of IBARW... And also, you said above that you were hurt by those comments. So now I feel like I should say something, and I apologize if the effect is different from my intention. Ie: to possibly make that statement feel less hurtful for you.
First things first, however. I want to say that I admire you for the stand you are taking and your refusal to back down in the face of an utterly ridiculous amount of people sticking their fingers in their ears and trying to yell "lalala" loud enough to drown out people trying to talk seriously about race issues. I have really enjoyed the sheer number of thought provoking posts that have come out on these topics since WisCon. I hope everyone who has spoken out will continue to do so, and that more and more people do so as well.
Anyway.
My assumption is that the reason you are hurt by the statement that "Asians are white" is because it feels like a complete denial of your own identity, subsuming you against your wishes, at the expense of important aspects of your personhood, into the white collective. Or, as we like to call ourselves, The Borg. I think most anybody would find that hurtful.
However, I don't think that's what people mean when they say that. I think the real meaning behind that phrase comes from the harmful conflation between race and class. I believe what they mean to say is that "we perceive the Asian minority group as having economic and educational status equal to that of whites, whereas we perceive other minority groups as not." Because, yes, of course, there are harmful racial stereotypes about Asians. Female Asian fetishism and the stereotype of Asian subservience are particularly vile.
But the stereotype of "is inherently good at math and science" is barely even in the same ballpark as the stereotypes of "is poor, uneducated, and predisposed to criminality" that exist about blacks and Hispanics. My American culture hive mind suggests that Random Asian Person Walking Down the Street is probably (or will be perceived as being) college-educated, holding a white collar job, and being basically middle class. (Atleast, on the East Coast this is true. My feeling is that the degree of racism is directly proportional the the population density of that minority group, so perhaps this is different on the West Coast where Asians are a much bigger percentage) That same perception of "being middle class" does not exist for many other racial minority groups, which is why, I think, people will try to draw the distinction. But instead of doing this by bringing class issues into the discussion they fall prey to the conflation and try to use racial shorthand instead.
I'm sorry you were hurt by those statements (as well as the many other lovely pieces of vitriole that have cropped up in this extended discussion) and I certainly can't claim to speak for the commenters, but I think the intent was to make a statement about class, not to deny your identity and sense of self.
So that's my comment. I hope I was able to be atleast halfway coherent.
no subject
First things first, however. I want to say that I admire you for the stand you are taking and your refusal to back down in the face of an utterly ridiculous amount of people sticking their fingers in their ears and trying to yell "lalala" loud enough to drown out people trying to talk seriously about race issues. I have really enjoyed the sheer number of thought provoking posts that have come out on these topics since WisCon. I hope everyone who has spoken out will continue to do so, and that more and more people do so as well.
Anyway.
My assumption is that the reason you are hurt by the statement that "Asians are white" is because it feels like a complete denial of your own identity, subsuming you against your wishes, at the expense of important aspects of your personhood, into the white collective. Or, as we like to call ourselves, The Borg. I think most anybody would find that hurtful.
However, I don't think that's what people mean when they say that. I think the real meaning behind that phrase comes from the harmful conflation between race and class. I believe what they mean to say is that "we perceive the Asian minority group as having economic and educational status equal to that of whites, whereas we perceive other minority groups as not." Because, yes, of course, there are harmful racial stereotypes about Asians. Female Asian fetishism and the stereotype of Asian subservience are particularly vile.
But the stereotype of "is inherently good at math and science" is barely even in the same ballpark as the stereotypes of "is poor, uneducated, and predisposed to criminality" that exist about blacks and Hispanics. My American culture hive mind suggests that Random Asian Person Walking Down the Street is probably (or will be perceived as being) college-educated, holding a white collar job, and being basically middle class. (Atleast, on the East Coast this is true. My feeling is that the degree of racism is directly proportional the the population density of that minority group, so perhaps this is different on the West Coast where Asians are a much bigger percentage) That same perception of "being middle class" does not exist for many other racial minority groups, which is why, I think, people will try to draw the distinction. But instead of doing this by bringing class issues into the discussion they fall prey to the conflation and try to use racial shorthand instead.
I'm sorry you were hurt by those statements (as well as the many other lovely pieces of vitriole that have cropped up in this extended discussion) and I certainly can't claim to speak for the commenters, but I think the intent was to make a statement about class, not to deny your identity and sense of self.
So that's my comment. I hope I was able to be atleast halfway coherent.